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Enterprise Library (what should I use...)Hi, what is really worthwhile to use of Ent Library framework (e.g. Data Access
Application Block) ? Who has used in practice ? Thanks a lot ! I'm of the opinion that the DAB is more trouble than it's worth. It requires
just as much training, experience and troubleshooting as just coding ADO.NET. Behind the scenes it uses some dubious practices and AFAIK does not support the enhancements in the 2.0 Framework. Just stick with ADO.NET. -- Show quote____________________________________ William (Bill) Vaughn Author, Mentor, Consultant Microsoft MVP INETA Speaker www.betav.com/blog/billva www.betav.com Please reply only to the newsgroup so that others can benefit. This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no rights. __________________________________ "Bruce One" <r***@virtualsoftware.com.br> wrote in message news:1EDD45BA-0145-4CDB-A92C-8AEDBD85C5A6@microsoft.com... > Hi, what is really worthwhile to use of Ent Library framework (e.g. Data > Access > Application Block) ? Who has used in practice ? > > Thanks a lot ! William (Bill) Vaughn wrote:
> Behind the scenes it uses some dubious practices Hi Bill, can you elaborate on those two comments a bit? Just curious, since > and AFAIK does not support the enhancements in the 2.0 Framework. > Just stick with ADO.NET. MS bills the EntLib as a "best practices" library. Matt,
As Microsoft says that there is a best practise, than in my idea they should delete all the rest from Visual Studio Net what is not well to use and cut the prices accoording to that. (I always get the idea that these best practises are written by persons, who are not able to get the same idea in their own organisation or in the rest of the world). It remembers me once a discussion with some developer if two parallel lines exist. I left the discussion in half an hour, but they were goin on about that the next day as well. Our organisation had nothing to do with parallel lines. Just my opinion, Cor Show quote "Matt Noonan" <nore***@noreply.com> schreef in bericht news:ein47G%23nGHA.4864@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl... > William (Bill) Vaughn wrote: >> Behind the scenes it uses some dubious practices >> and AFAIK does not support the enhancements in the 2.0 Framework. >> Just stick with ADO.NET. > > Hi Bill, can you elaborate on those two comments a bit? Just curious, > since MS bills the EntLib as a "best practices" library. > > -- > Matt Noonan > EasyObjects.NET: The O/RM for the Enterprise Library > http://www.easyobjects.net > > Cor Ligthert [MVP] wrote:
> Matt, I won't argue with you there! ;-)> > As Microsoft says that there is a best practise, than in my idea they > should delete all the rest from Visual Studio Net what is not well to > use and cut the prices accoording to that. > > (I always get the idea that these best practises are written by > persons, who are not able to get the same idea in their own > organisation or in the rest of the world). > Yeah, sometimes the purists don't understand that you have work that needs > It remembers me once a discussion with some developer if two parallel > lines exist. I left the discussion in half an hour, but they were > goin on about that the next day as well. Our organisation had nothing > to do with parallel lines. to get done, even if it isn't the ideal solution. Matt,
Did you consider using an ORM product such as LLBLGen Pro? http://www.llblgen.com/ -- Show quoteMiha Markic [MVP C#, INETA Country Leader for Slovenia] RightHand .NET consulting & development www.rthand.com Blog: http://cs.rthand.com/blogs/blog_with_righthand/ "Matt Noonan" <nore***@noreply.com> wrote in message news:ein47G%23nGHA.4864@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl... > William (Bill) Vaughn wrote: >> Behind the scenes it uses some dubious practices >> and AFAIK does not support the enhancements in the 2.0 Framework. >> Just stick with ADO.NET. > > Hi Bill, can you elaborate on those two comments a bit? Just curious, > since MS bills the EntLib as a "best practices" library. > > -- > Matt Noonan > EasyObjects.NET: The O/RM for the Enterprise Library > http://www.easyobjects.net > > Miha Markic [MVP C#] wrote:
I do use an ORM, but I didn't ask the original question... :) > I do use an ORM, but I didn't ask the original question... :) I wonder which one. ;-PShow quote > -- > Matt Noonan > EasyObjects.NET: The O/RM for the Enterprise Library > http://www.easyobjects.net > > Miha Markic [MVP C#] wrote:
Show quote >> I do use an ORM, but I didn't ask the original question... :) > > I wonder which one. ;-P :-D Well, as I could understand for what I have read so far, DAB is not so
helpful, it might even get worse the overall performance . But what about the other blocks (criptography, security...) ? Have u used any of them for real? Show quote "William (Bill) Vaughn" wrote: > I'm of the opinion that the DAB is more trouble than it's worth. It requires > just as much training, experience and troubleshooting as just coding > ADO.NET. Behind the scenes it uses some dubious practices and AFAIK does not > support the enhancements in the 2.0 Framework. Just stick with ADO.NET. > > -- > ____________________________________ > William (Bill) Vaughn > Author, Mentor, Consultant > Microsoft MVP > INETA Speaker > www.betav.com/blog/billva > www.betav.com > Please reply only to the newsgroup so that others can benefit. > This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no rights. > __________________________________ > > "Bruce One" <r***@virtualsoftware.com.br> wrote in message > news:1EDD45BA-0145-4CDB-A92C-8AEDBD85C5A6@microsoft.com... > > Hi, what is really worthwhile to use of Ent Library framework (e.g. Data > > Access > > Application Block) ? Who has used in practice ? > > > > Thanks a lot ! > > > Bruce One wrote:
> Well, as I could understand for what I have read so far, DAB is not so There is a reflection hit for figuring out which data provider to use, but > helpful, it might even get worse the overall performance . other than that the performance is acceptable. But obviously, you can beat it by writing straight ADO.NET. Using the EntLib DAAB, you should choose carefully if you need some of the built-in features (perf counters, WMI, database independence). If you need pure speed, you'll probably need something more lightweight. > But what about the other blocks (criptography, security...) ? Have u They work great, but again, if you need to analyze which of the features of > used any of them for real? the EntLib you need. If you are already using DAAB, then using the Caching Block fits right in. It's really a question of how much you want to "buy-in" to using the EntLib. The DAAB is definitely a pain in the butt, but it is NOT the Enterprise
library. The data bits in the Enterprise library are as different from DAAB as LLBLGen Pro is from LLBLGen (the original free tool). Having said that, I am a bit torn over Ent Lib or not. Overall, I am aiming more for an ORM, but the Ent Library does give you a lot of bang for the buck. -- Show quoteGregory A. Beamer ************************************************* Think Outside the Box! ************************************************* "William (Bill) Vaughn" <billvaRemoveT***@nwlink.com> wrote in message news:ON4slP7nGHA.4172@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl... > I'm of the opinion that the DAB is more trouble than it's worth. It > requires just as much training, experience and troubleshooting as just > coding ADO.NET. Behind the scenes it uses some dubious practices and AFAIK > does not support the enhancements in the 2.0 Framework. Just stick with > ADO.NET. > > -- > ____________________________________ > William (Bill) Vaughn > Author, Mentor, Consultant > Microsoft MVP > INETA Speaker > www.betav.com/blog/billva > www.betav.com > Please reply only to the newsgroup so that others can benefit. > This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no > rights. > __________________________________ > > "Bruce One" <r***@virtualsoftware.com.br> wrote in message > news:1EDD45BA-0145-4CDB-A92C-8AEDBD85C5A6@microsoft.com... >> Hi, what is really worthwhile to use of Ent Library framework (e.g. Data >> Access >> Application Block) ? Who has used in practice ? >> >> Thanks a lot ! > > > Having said that, I am a bit torn over Ent Lib or not. Overall, I am Yep, me too. Out of curiosity, which one?> aiming > more for an ORM, -- Miha Markic [MVP C#, INETA Country Leader for Slovenia] RightHand .NET consulting & development www.rthand.com Blog: http://cs.rthand.com/blogs/blog_with_righthand/ For the records, I use MyGeneration O/M, which besides having its own format
(Dooads), I can create my own templates...LLBGEN is better?? Show quote "Miha Markic [MVP C#]" wrote: > > > Having said that, I am a bit torn over Ent Lib or not. Overall, I am > > aiming > > more for an ORM, > > Yep, me too. Out of curiosity, which one? > > -- > Miha Markic [MVP C#, INETA Country Leader for Slovenia] > RightHand .NET consulting & development www.rthand.com > Blog: http://cs.rthand.com/blogs/blog_with_righthand/ > > > "Bruce One" <r***@virtualsoftware.com.br> wrote in message No idea, as I never used MyGen. Anyway, why do you need DAAB then (if you news:EB9DF0E5-AAAA-4C6B-B6BA-C1CC7E6A7511@microsoft.com... > For the records, I use MyGeneration O/M, which besides having its own > format > (Dooads), I can create my own templates...LLBGEN is better?? are using an ORM)? For complicated queries? -- Miha Markic [MVP C#, INETA Country Leader for Slovenia] RightHand .NET consulting & development www.rthand.com Blog: http://cs.rthand.com/blogs/blog_with_righthand/ Got it, but what about the other aspects of Ent Library (criptography,
security, Error Handling...), is it interesting? Or it would be better to use framework 2.0 package only...? Show quote "Cowboy (Gregory A. Beamer)" wrote: > The DAAB is definitely a pain in the butt, but it is NOT the Enterprise > library. The data bits in the Enterprise library are as different from DAAB > as LLBLGen Pro is from LLBLGen (the original free tool). > > Having said that, I am a bit torn over Ent Lib or not. Overall, I am aiming > more for an ORM, but the Ent Library does give you a lot of bang for the > buck. > > -- > Gregory A. Beamer > > ************************************************* > Think Outside the Box! > ************************************************* > "William (Bill) Vaughn" <billvaRemoveT***@nwlink.com> wrote in message > news:ON4slP7nGHA.4172@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl... > > I'm of the opinion that the DAB is more trouble than it's worth. It > > requires just as much training, experience and troubleshooting as just > > coding ADO.NET. Behind the scenes it uses some dubious practices and AFAIK > > does not support the enhancements in the 2.0 Framework. Just stick with > > ADO.NET. > > > > -- > > ____________________________________ > > William (Bill) Vaughn > > Author, Mentor, Consultant > > Microsoft MVP > > INETA Speaker > > www.betav.com/blog/billva > > www.betav.com > > Please reply only to the newsgroup so that others can benefit. > > This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no > > rights. > > __________________________________ > > > > "Bruce One" <r***@virtualsoftware.com.br> wrote in message > > news:1EDD45BA-0145-4CDB-A92C-8AEDBD85C5A6@microsoft.com... > >> Hi, what is really worthwhile to use of Ent Library framework (e.g. Data > >> Access > >> Application Block) ? Who has used in practice ? > >> > >> Thanks a lot ! > > > > > > > Cowboy (Gregory A. Beamer) wrote:
> The DAAB is definitely a pain in the butt, but it is NOT the I'm starting to wonder, are we talking about the same thing? Are you > Enterprise library. The data bits in the Enterprise library are as > different from DAAB as LLBLGen Pro is from LLBLGen (the original free > tool). thinking of the SqlHelper class, which was the original DAAB? There is also a DAAB in the EntLib, but it's completely different from SqlHelper. > Then check out EasyObjects.NET (http://www.easyobjects.net), which is built > Having said that, I am a bit torn over Ent Lib or not. Overall, I am > aiming more for an ORM, but the Ent Library does give you a lot of > bang for the buck. on top of the EntLib. :) Isn't that kind of what the TableAdapters are? I know they sure are a nice
piece of work. I used to use EntLib in 2003, but with 2005 I haven't really found a need for them. Show quote "Cowboy (Gregory A. Beamer)" <NoSpamMgbworld@comcast.netNoSpamM> wrote in message news:%23aCK$6CoGHA.4340@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl... > The DAAB is definitely a pain in the butt, but it is NOT the Enterprise > library. The data bits in the Enterprise library are as different from > DAAB as LLBLGen Pro is from LLBLGen (the original free tool). > > Having said that, I am a bit torn over Ent Lib or not. Overall, I am > aiming more for an ORM, but the Ent Library does give you a lot of bang > for the buck. > > -- > Gregory A. Beamer > > ************************************************* > Think Outside the Box! > ************************************************* > "William (Bill) Vaughn" <billvaRemoveT***@nwlink.com> wrote in message > news:ON4slP7nGHA.4172@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl... >> I'm of the opinion that the DAB is more trouble than it's worth. It >> requires just as much training, experience and troubleshooting as just >> coding ADO.NET. Behind the scenes it uses some dubious practices and >> AFAIK does not support the enhancements in the 2.0 Framework. Just stick >> with ADO.NET. >> >> -- >> ____________________________________ >> William (Bill) Vaughn >> Author, Mentor, Consultant >> Microsoft MVP >> INETA Speaker >> www.betav.com/blog/billva >> www.betav.com >> Please reply only to the newsgroup so that others can benefit. >> This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no >> rights. >> __________________________________ >> >> "Bruce One" <r***@virtualsoftware.com.br> wrote in message >> news:1EDD45BA-0145-4CDB-A92C-8AEDBD85C5A6@microsoft.com... >>> Hi, what is really worthwhile to use of Ent Library framework (e.g. Data >>> Access >>> Application Block) ? Who has used in practice ? >>> >>> Thanks a lot ! >> >> > > Bruce One wrote:
> Hi, what is really worthwhile to use of Ent Library framework (e.g. I use it in practice, but I also use my O/RM on top of it to simplify the > Data Access Application Block) ? Who has used in practice ? > > Thanks a lot ! usage. :) DAAB and the Enterprise Library are two completely different things. There
is a learning curve for each, but the provider/factory model in the new Enterprise Library is preferable to the old DAAB way of doing things. I have use DAAB in projects, but found that it went counter to the direction I wanted to go, at least on most. It is possible to add a "generic" wrapper to the front, to have DAAB database agnostic, but some of the methods, esp. the DataReader methods, are painful. -- Show quoteGregory A. Beamer ************************************************* Think Outside the Box! ************************************************* "Bruce One" <r***@virtualsoftware.com.br> wrote in message news:1EDD45BA-0145-4CDB-A92C-8AEDBD85C5A6@microsoft.com... > Hi, what is really worthwhile to use of Ent Library framework (e.g. Data > Access > Application Block) ? Who has used in practice ? > > Thanks a lot !  |
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